Any Educators or Students Out There???
It's getting a bit lonely here!!! :-(
There must be hundreds of schools, colleges, universities, teachers and students using RapMan and BfB3000 machines, yet we seem to hear very little from you!
PLEASE, PLEASE take a little bit of time to post some comments/photos about what you are doing. What has been successful? What projects do you/your students do? Do you use your machine in a extra curricular club, or in lessons/lectures? Are you in the process of building a RapMan- how are you getting on?
OR
Are you looking for ideas? Is your machine under-used 'cos you don't know what to print with it? .... why not share your thoughts?
Go on, don't be shy, they're a very friendly bunch on this forum :-)
Dave
PS. If you are short of ideas or want to see what I'm getting up to have a look at my blog http://rapman-education.posterous.com/ or browse the Teaching and learning resources on the wiki. http://wiki.bitsfrombytes.com/index.php/Main_Page#Education
update..... My new blog (which also archives all the posts from the previous one) can be found here http://3dprintineducation.wordpress.com/
I am a student that just got the project to make our NEW 3d printer work, I fallowed all of the pre-setup instructions, and the raft prints well, but I am having trouble with warping issues. I am using a 3d touch, double head, with a clear PLA, and a blue ABS. The part I am making is only 2 inches big. It is a cube inside of a cube. I have tried to add a 100w light bulb under the table because I thought that the model was cooling down too quickly…I have attached my STL file so someone can look at it and tell me if the model is built right or if I am doing anything wrong...Can anyone help me out?
Hi. I am an engineering technician working for Oxford and Cherwell Valley College, currently
taking a part constructed rapman 3.0 to full operation over the next 3-4 weeks.
Trying to find information on setting up the three limit switches for home position.
X axis is actuated from flange on the print head and appears to operate correctly.
Unable to find any actuating part for the other two axes.
If the precise position of home is not necessary, for instance could be +- 10-20 mm from
the area where the switches are located, then I have no problem.
With software adjustments, I should be able to print at whatever point I wish.
Ill try to post my experiences.
I.N.
I am an online teacher certification programs student and I'm still trying to figure out how to use the RapMan machine. A step by step guide on how to use it would be really appreciated since I intend to master it before becoming a teacher myself.
I am a Project Lead The Way Teacher from Indiana, USA. I used my Rapman 3.2 to print out re-engineered soda bottles. we printed at 50% to save material, but since I only have a single head(upgrade is backordered) it was hard to print some of thier designs without support material. Next project will be something different. Not sure what yet.
hello Dave,
I'm Horace, a teacher of K-12 college.
Recently I bought a 3D printer from BFB, but I face many many problems.
I can't fix the machine well...
Anyway, nice to meet you there!
I watched yours blog. You are realliy great~!
If you don't mind, please share some more information and idea to me.
I and my students are working hard to fix the Rapman3.1 now.
We will try to make some 3D models soon by sketchup.
BTW, do u have facebook? You can add me thru [email protected],
or keep in touch via this email.
Thank you!
have a good day~
B.Rgs.
Horace Luk
Hi Dave
I have just ordered a Rapman 3.2 for my technology Dept at Hele's School in Plymouth, looking forward to it arriving and us building it. I thought we might be able to run the build as part of an A2 product design course and then get the students to package it as their actual coursework. We'll see. I would like to come and see what you are up to in your dept and a 3D printer in action if that were possible over the next couple of months during our "gain time" haha. regards Huw Phillips
Hi Huw
Good to hear from another educator fairly local in the uk.
Great to hear you have purchased a RapMan kit... Hope the build goes well.
You are more than welcome to visit, I'll PM my email address so that you can contact me a bit nearer the time... And if that released time ever materialises (strange how it always seems to vanish with preparation for the next school year)
In the mean time have a look at my blog http://RapMan-education.posterous.com or my department blog on our school website www.clevedonschool.co.uk/blogs/products/
Dave
Hi Horace,
When you say that you are having problems, can you give us a few moer specifics? Or, perhaps, take a picture or video that demonstrates what you mean.
I'm not an active teacher now; but, taught Science in the dark ages. And, I believe having a working 3D printer is a great asset for any school.
Thanks,
Tom Meeks
Hi Dave
We've done it!!! we've got ourselves a working Rapman, thanks to one of my Y13 Product Deign studnts(thanks Ryan - some public recognition for you!)
So far we've made two ducks, a USB holder from thingyverse which went wrong and didnt print the hook and we've just made a spool holder again from thingyverse to hold said spools of ABS or PLA on the side of the cupbaord which we are using to house the Rapman.
We need to look at print times as everythig is taking a long time ATM. We are going to build two repraps next ( are we allowed to talk about the rivals on here LOL).
On the RAPMAN forum Dave there's a guy in Exeter who is hosting a RUG (Rapman User Group) meeting in Exeter on 28th July, which a few people including me are hoping to go along to. You might be interested. I'll PM you the details.
theres a lot of excitement in the dept about this new bit of kit so hopefully we can start using it within the curriculum soon
Huw
Hi Huw
Comgratulations to you and your students on completing your build and becoming owners and users of a RapMan! Really looking forwards to hearing how things go and hopefully seeing some pictures/posts about what you get up to with it and hopefully some innovative 3D prints.
Glad to hear your test prints have gone well... Now the real fun starts when you start printing your own/students designs... It would be fantastic if you could share any projects or resources for teaching and learning with your 3D printers (I can always post them on the BfB wiki for you on http://wiki.bitsfrombytes.com/index.php/Main_Page#Education )
It is probably ok to mention "the rivals" (reprap) after all the reprap project is where RapMan originated and then developed into bfb3000 and 3DTouch... Sounds like a brave move building two of them though : - )
Anyway, it's brilliant to hear from another "educator" and please do keep us informed as to how you and your students progress with your RapMan (and other machines)
Dave
Hi Dave,
I take fairly long breaks from 3D printing. However, in early summer I got 2 new 3D printers that are faster and easier to use than my good old RapMan. In particular, I got a PLA printer that can print 20 hours unsupervised. I took me 2 years to implement a simple and safe filament holder with a chemistry retort stand (http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:28590) and may have helped a lot...
Over the last days I created a series of Lego pieces that might be of interest to your kids if they have younger brothers and sisters. However, these blocks are fairly big and take a long time to print if you go for "decent enough" quality. Don't know if you can print for them after class.
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:31284
Lego only can be printed with a very well calibrated RapMan which mine ceased to be after we moved office 2 years ago. But the better BFB models like the Touch should be able to wing this w/o trouble. However, since they use 3mm filament, the STLs could be off the mark and would have to be regenerated from the OpenSCAD code. One also can print the models in Duplo size, something that the RapMan does well. However, print time then gets staggering...
Last fall I also taught a pilot class with 5 students in edutech about digital design and fabrication (including 3D modeling/printing, vinyl cutting, embroidery, and music). I also invited the local guys that provide technology support to primary and secondary teachers. The liked the class, but did not do projects... Documentation is unfortunately in french.
Next fall (2013) I will reconduct it and require more 3D work from my students. Here is draft of my plans.
- Cheers ! - Daniel
The 3DTouch in the atrium of the Merchant Venturer's Building in the University of Bristol has been available to the students for just over a week now and has been in almost continuous use. So far the student have mostly been using it to print cases for their Raspberry Pis, though there has also been a Rubics Cube and I did a Venus de Milo to decorate my desk.
My students are excited about the printer, however I spend more time fixing the machine than printing.
We have printed a few cool items, but spend most of our time puzzling over how to get ABS, or PLA or a combination of materials working.
Last week we were all jazzed to be printing with new Maker Bot PLA (BFB PLA goes brittle in a hurry) and then after two two hour projects PLA is no longer extruding. So I now have to spend part of my winter break troubleshooting what is wrong and resetting up the machine.
I have a BSB 3000 running updated firmware and Axon software.
This machine reminds me of my 1950 Chevy truck that I had as a kid: I learned a great deal about turning wrenches just to be able to drive it to school occasionaly.
Forward
> Last week we were all jazzed to be printing with new Maker Bot PLA (BFB PLA goes brittle in a hurry) and then after two two hour projects PLA is no longer extruding. So I now have to spend part of my winter break troubleshooting what is wrong and resetting up the machine.
Got lots of dust around the extruder drive lead screw? Check to see if the filament is stripped (gouged out where the drive lead screw touches it) by heating the head to working temp and pulling the filament back out of the nozzle. If this is the case, clip it off above the stripped area and re-insert. Whatever temperature you were setting for the PLA, raise it by at least 10C (I've been running my NatureWorks PLA at 205C-215C) and do a manual purge to be certain that flow has been restored. Then try a print; having set that higher temperature in the material setting and then re-slice to have the new temperature applied in the new build file.
Stripping can occur for a number of reasons. Too low a temperature causes the flow rate to drop because the melted plastic cannot exit the hot end fast enough. This causes heat to migrate back up the extruder body and soften the filament where the lead screw contacts it. Then, it strips more readily. Lots of destring (reverse flow) can also contribute to stripping, as it is a jarring movement.
Thanks Speed, I upped my makerbot PLA temperatures, reset the Axon settings and we are printing in PLA again.
Alan
Glad I could help you enjoy your Holidays. :) There are few things more vexing for me than something that's busted. Happy Christmas!
Hi Dave.
My name is Hanno. Dt teacher form Caterham High School in Illford, Essex. We got a RapMan 3.2 last November after having persuaded my head of department that 3D printing has come a long way and it could really get the pupils enthusiastic about cad/cam. It took a good half a term to put the printer together with the help of some enthusiastic students, working after school. The instructions were superb, but there was a lot of work to be done.
Now it has taken equally as long to get the printer to print in reasonable quality. The ducks come out well, however everything else starts fine, but by the time a print is finished there are mistakes here and there. So currently any 3D printing club activity involves figuring out how to get the printer to be more reliable. and sending messages back and forth between your technical department.
Also, I'm regretting of getting the 1 head education version and not the 2 head ultimate version. 1. you are really limited in what you can print with the one head solution. I spend most of this time trying to help pupils modify their designs to make them more suitable for printing. 2. The raft is impossible to remove from the models and 3. You are giving the educational resources away for free on your blog anyway.
Im Still enthusiastic about 3D printing, but definitely more down to earth about it now.
You should have a section on the website where we can post pictures of 3D prints with problems and their printer settings, and then a picture of a good quality print and how the problem was solved.
Hi Hanno, and welcome to the forum!
great to hear from another educator, and great to hear that you have got your RapMan up and running.
re your single head machine.... Don't fret too much about support material... As you gain experience you will find that you can get away with many prints without it ... It's surprising how much overhang you can have without needing support material, also many times you will find that simply re orientation of the object will overcome the need too. I have a dual head rapman and yes it is really useful to have it loaded with different polymers in the 2 heads but I rarely use it for support material, most often I print with a PLA raft and abs object or vice versa as they can be easily peeled apart. Support material with the dual head rapman is reserved for when it is absolutely necessary (it is slower than on our 3DTouch). .... Also don't forget that you can upgrade at a later date.... The extra extruder is about £300 if I remember correctly. .... Also if you get students to do some brilliant work with the RapMan it does help justify bidding for extra money for a 3D Touch from the Headteacher or PTA.
You also mentioned the teaching resources... Yes they are free and can be found on the wiki http://wiki.bitsfrombytes.com/index.php/Main_Page#Education they have come about as a result of developing resources and projects for use in my own school, I just thought it would help others get started. If you fancy sharing any ideas or resources it would be most welcome... Attach then to a post on this forum or contact me by PM and I'll post them on the wiki (properly accredited of course!)
its good to hear you are still enthusiastic about 3D printing..... Yes there is a learning curve but it does get easier as you progress (honestly!)... Keep going, it is worth it. The students gain so much "learning" through its use, and it is a great insight into the principals of the industry where machines cost hundreds of thousands.
i like your idea about a trouble shooter page on the website.... But I don't work for 3DS /BfB so have no control and very little influence .... Maybe a free resource on the wiki is needed, when I get time (as you know "free time" in teaching is a rarity).... Unless of course you fancy giving it a go yourself as and when you gain experience :o)
Dave
PS.... Don't forget to share some pictures of your own and your students work.... Great to see what others get up to with their machines, and a good way to get new ideas!
Hi Hanno,
Welcome to the Education Forum. As an ex-teacher and a founder member of Bits From Bytes it is great to see so many ideas being shared here. Thank-you for the compliment on the build manuals - I will pass those on.
I think Dave is right to suggest sticking with planning your parts to print with a single print head. There is much fertile ground for exploring with your students how to get the best from your machine by planning to print without support (as required with a single head machine). Indeed better parts can often be produced by a suitable redesign.
If you find you are running into printer problems don't forget our technical support section. Simply raise a ticket and someone will come back to you to discuss the problems you are having.
I also like your idea about a page to post about the problem and solution with a particular print, but isn't that what this forum is all about? Simply start a new thread, add details of your print problem (don't forget to add plenty of details about the settings you are using and photos of the parts in close up) and sit back while others offer potential solutions. At the end of the process pop back and share your working settings etc. so those who follow after can learn from your work.
I hope to see more of your posts in the near future - don't forget that your students will love to see their parts being shown off here on the forum - why not get them to register and post their own work?!
Iain
I am an educator in Georgia (USA). I teach an engineering technology sequence at the high school level. Late last year I acquired two 3D Touch machines for my school lab. Results have been mixed, as the machines have not yet proven themselves to be reliable. My students and their parents are very excited about the possibilities these machines introduce, especially in contrast to the expensive and fragile parts made on our V-Flash machine. Within a couple of weeks, though, our excitement turned into frustration and concern. We are a technically competent bunch and solved problems related to brittle PLA and adhesion of rafts to the beds. What has caused us to wonder if these machines are mature products has been a random failure, where in the drives stop working and the motionless head dwells in one position while the extruder continues to run. This has ruined many print jobs, melted craters into print beds and damaged two hot ends.
We have two cases open with BFB technical support and while I feel we have had timely communication and prompt replacement of parts, we have not yet seen the issue resolved. Literally the machine can run a job several times in a row and then fail at some random time. If one is not visually monitoring the print job, it only takes a few minutes to create a glob of material that pits the bed and tears the silicone insulator off of the hot end. Though I have asked several times if this failure mode has been seen by other customers the question has never been answered.
Today the machines are packed up for return to BFB for troubleshooting and repair and hopefully will prove to be reasonably reliable afterwards. I am surprised though, as I read these messages on the wiki that a system marketed as a tool for educators in primary and secondary schools could be so unreliable. Products built for education need to be exceptionally robust and reliable. A machine that takes one, two or eight hours to run a print job should not need a babysitter to prevent it from damaging itself.
Michael,
I am a very technically inclined hobbyist. I have built 2 makerbots, 1 sells mendel, 1 prusa and a mendel max. The 3dt is my fifth 3d printer in 3 years. I can tell you that NONE of my printers have worked out of the box. All of them have required hours....days....weeks of tuning, fixing, tuning, fixing.....all the things they dont tell you on CNN and and 3d printing press reviews. Many of my friends are 20+ year mechanical engineers....and we have all faced this. I went thru my "Shouldnt this 4k printer just work!" periods.....and I still have them.
I can say that the 3d touch was the fastest to get printing, and the highest quality prints.....but it still took me weeks. I have not seen the failure modes you describe......but I know the frustration!!
My only point is to urge patience and wish you luck!
W
Michael,
I am a very technically inclined hobbyist. I have built 2 makerbots, 1 sells mendel, 1 prusa and a mendel max. The 3dt is my fifth 3d printer in 3 years. I can tell you that NONE of my printers have worked out of the box. All of them have required hours....days....weeks of tuning, fixing, tuning, fixing.....all the things they dont tell you on CNN and and 3d printing press reviews. Many of my friends are 20+ year mechanical engineers....and we have all faced this. I went thru my "Shouldnt this 4k printer just work!" periods.....and I still have them.
I can say that the 3d touch was the fastest to get printing, and the highest quality prints.....but it still took me weeks. I have not seen the failure modes you describe......but I know the frustration!!
My only point is to urge patience and wish you luck!
W
Hi again,
I've been a bit slow to post any pictures of products we have made with the Rapman 3.2. So far we have made some handles and have had a varying degree of success. Solid handles are turning out fine, but anything hollow seems to not work out so well. I have tried to ask from the technical support how the duck model was designed as it seems to have two skins. the inside one has all the roque bits and supports the outer skin with a space between these two. However, all I got from the technical was... 'we didn't design the duck'. Would any one else know? There doesn't seem to be a setting in axon for this kind of solution.
Also another issue we have is that the fan does not run when printing. It runs when manually heating or cooling the hothead, but not when printing. Again the technical person said that it is not supposed to run when printing using ABS, however it runs when pringin the ABS duck, so I am not sure about that, and I really don't feel that there is enough support happening. This makes all hollow shapes that have overhangs impossible to print as the extruded plastic does not set and ends up expanding past the hothead which then presses down to it as it prints.
We also had the hot head suddenly stop as it was printing a raft and create a blob which then damaged both the centre of the printing bed and took of part of the silicon insulator. So now it seems that you can't leave the machine when it is printing. And there was no obstructions!
Being a busy teacher, I have to say I have been disappointed. I simply don't have the time to deal with issues that this technical. I loved putting the printer together and how enthusiastic everyone was, But as the issues seem more technical, rather that being able to design effectively for printing, I have seen more and more pupils loose heart and interest.
It would be really good to organise a meet up or something for all London teachers working with rapman. What is the warranty like on these self build kits. I don't feel the support is there. What is the support like for 3D touch?
Hi again,
I've been a bit slow to post any pictures of products we have made with the Rapman 3.2. So far we have made some handles and have had a varying degree of success. Solid handles are turning out fine, but anything hollow seems to not work out so well. I have tried to ask from the technical support how the duck model was designed as it seems to have two skins. the inside one has all the roque bits and supports the outer skin with a space between these two. However, all I got from the technical was... 'we didn't design the duck'. Would any one else know? There doesn't seem to be a setting in axon for this kind of solution.
Also another issue we have is that the fan does not run when printing. It runs when manually heating or cooling the hothead, but not when printing. Again the technical person said that it is not supposed to run when printing using ABS, however it runs when pringin the ABS duck, so I am not sure about that, and I really don't feel that there is enough support happening. This makes all hollow shapes that have overhangs impossible to print as the extruded plastic does not set and ends up expanding past the hothead which then presses down to it as it prints.
We also had the hot head suddenly stop as it was printing a raft and create a blob which then damaged both the centre of the printing bed and took of part of the silicon insulator. So now it seems that you can't leave the machine when it is printing. And there was no obstructions!
Being a busy teacher, I have to say I have been disappointed. I simply don't have the time to deal with issues that this technical. I loved putting the printer together and how enthusiastic everyone was, But as the issues seem more technical, rather that being able to design effectively for printing, I have seen more and more pupils loose heart and interest.
It would be really good to organise a meet up or something for all London teachers working with rapman. What is the warranty like on these self build kits. I don't feel the support is there. What is the support like for 3D touch?
> Solid handles are turning out fine, but anything hollow seems to not work out so well. I have tried to ask from the technical support how the duck model was designed as it seems to have two skins. the inside one has all the roque bits and supports the outer skin with a space between these two. However, all I got from the technical was... 'we didn't design the duck'.
Astounding...
I understand the need to learn to use new equipment and technologies. I worked in the automotive manufacturing industry for 25 years before becoming a teacher. While I am technically inclined, I am also a customer. Many companies understand the need to satisfy their customers. How would you feel if your car required "hours, days, weeks of fixing, tuning, fixing." Or perhaps your phone or pacemaker? I didn't shop CNN for information on which printer to buy, but perhaps if a manufacturer was going to market a product that required hours, days weeks of work to make it functional, the manufacturer should disclose that fact and perhaps point it out in their press releases and advertisements. I am not being paid to troubleshoot and repair this equipment.
The point here is not that I need patience or luck, I need the equipment that the manufacturer accepted my money for to provide a working product, not one that damages itself for no discernible reason.
I have observed the sudden, random stop of the print head and the unwelcome blob from hell on two of my 3D Touch machines. Thus far I have heard no root cause analysis or resolution from technical support, nor has 3D Systems responded to my question about whether this failure mode has been reported by other customers.
I have observed the sudden, random stop of the print head and the unwelcome blob from hell on two of my 3D Touch machines. Thus far I have heard no root cause analysis or resolution from technical support, nor has 3D Systems responded to my question about whether this failure mode has been reported by other customers.
Michael,
I cannot answer for BFB's lack of response.
I have not seen this with my BFB, but i've only been printing a month. I can tell you I've seen it with both of my makerbots and one of my mendels. To my earlier point, makerbot support was not able to help me either, or the handful of others who experienced it. Becuase they didnt know. It is maddening becuase it cant be easily replicated and happens seemingly randomly. Only thru wading thru posts and weeks of testing was I able to determine it was static/emf. A friend of mine who is also a automotive EE (yep, I'm in detroit) and botter was able to help me relocate boards and cables to minimize it. His analysis as an auto EE.....cars have 50 years of electrical design and know-how built in.....these machines have 3. Motors, high temps, non shielded mother boards, long moving cables, high freq PWM, are the absolute worst creators of EMF. In every case, I rerouted wires and the problem went away....I will never know exactly what fixed it. I do know I spent a lot of time pissed off. An identical machine next to it would seemingly print for weeks with no problems.......
Obviously I do not know if that whats going on here.....but I can tell you I still read about this issue on the reprap boards.
Again, good luck and wish I had more to offer.
W
Hi
We are a grammar school in Medway and are just about to buy a 3D Touch any advice before we set it up.
anyone elce in kent with one.