BfB Axon
Really hope I don't get into trouble for this from the BfB Guys ;) But so impressed that I just had to post this!
I dropped into BfB HQ today to collect a BfB3000 machine to take to the Design & Technology Association International Conference next week http://www.data.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=916&Itemid=721 ..... The 3000 will be so much more impressive than my beat up and very old RapMan (but it still has real "character") :) . Whilst I was there the guys very kindly gave me a pre-release copy of their new software "BfB Axon".... My first impressions at least from an education point of view are.... WOW!!!!
The place that this takes in the suite of software seems to be that this is a (fully working!) replacement for the "BfB front end Beta" and is in no way intended to challenge the position of NetFabb.... in my view it complements and joins the suite of Skeinforge and Netfabb. Infact Netfabb will remain an essential part of the RapMan kit for its superb stl fixing ability and build quality.
BfB Axon is built on Skeinforge (in fact clicking on the Advance settings button opens the familiar SF interface which should keep the settings tweakers happy)... but there are some significant enhancements ...
Easy user interface.
Tried and tested settings for BfB 3000 and RapMan with 1 to 3 heads (including support)
Rotate and scale (but not repair) stl files before processing.
Nice simple g-code viewer to view in 3D and step through layers
The program installer installs Python, Skeinforge and the interface (not certain about psyco or if installing this would have the same speed increase).... and on my win 7 laptop worked brilliantly (I have not tried it on any other OS).
So an "out of the box" solution is on the horizon.... don't quote me but I think it is going to be downloadable from the BfB website soon, and if I'm not mistaken at zero (or very low) cost!... now we can afford to install it on lots of machines and teach several/students at a time :)
I know that the BfB guys have been working VERY hard on this whilst at the same time trying to push out huge numbers of RapMen and BfB3000's. For me and for schools/colleges who are finding funding increasingly difficult in this current economic climate this looks like it will be a brilliant solution... Thanks BfB Guys :)
I really can't wait to show it off for the first time in public at the DATA Conference... Thanks guys for letting me do this.
Dave
PS As I said at the start... I hope the BfB Guys don't mind me "leaking" this info... So to save my neck please don't bug them by email (or on this forum) for further details, release dates, cost etc... at least not until the official release has happened ;D
Apologies Alan,
Instead of "released" I should really have said "available on the BfB website" ... and therefore the UK :-[
I think that BfB are going to make it available on the BfB website soon, but thanks for the link to RapManUSA.
Dave
PS. I've been printing all day with the default settings.... no problems whatsoever, and lovely quality prints.... Nice!
No problems. :) It did appear that RapManUSA may have jumped
the gun a little by posting the software on their site before BfB
made a public announcement.
Looks good, going to test it. Haven't been able to test Netfabb because our machine has been gone for months and since its back I haven't found the time to calibrate well. Ordered a digital caliper to finish Netfabb calibration.
I hope BfB can find some spare time to communicate a bit what they are working on, its a bit silent on the blog. Maybe we can do a trip together to the HQ :)
Yes very sorry for the lack of information flowing out from BfB HQ :-[ We are flat out sorting 3000 production as it's all gone a bit mad with orders which is good but we also need to keep all existing customer happy and we are all aware this has slipped, we have taken on extra internal sales staff to help with emails and orders etc. We will also keep a closer eye on the forum in the future and have a new boy starting on the 19th of July to help with this, some of you might have heard of him before but we will be very please when eD starts for those who don't know eD he's the engineer behind the original Darwin and the Mendel. He's back from travelling the world just ready to get struck back into the world of 3D printing.
Also we would definitely be happy to see anybody who wanted to visit and would also be very happy if people were interested to have a weekend get together/workshop where we can share ideas and try stuff out.
As for Axon is should have been up but Iain has broken himself again so hopefully tomorrow :)
Skinny eD! You couldn't have chosen better, Ian! :)
What is normal configuration to work with this soft (system+hardware)?
BfB Axon is a very simple "front end" for skeinforge and the guys from BfB have included some tried and tested settings.
Skeinforge runs under "Python" which runs on Windows, Linux/Unix, Mac OS X, and has been ported to the Java and .NET virtual machines.... but I don't know if Axon runs on anything other than windows (again others may know about this)
Axon is downloaded as an executable that automatically installs python, the user interface and skeinforge in the background)
Hardware... probably PC only... faster the better (although multi cores are not supported) skeinforge does loads of number crunching and can take a long time to process big or complex stl files
Hope this helps
Dave
What is normal configuration to work with this soft (system+hardware)?
Without engagement:
I tested the software successfully on a Windows 7 x64 and a recent Notebook with my RapMan 3.1 . Dave used it successfully on Windows 7 x86 (32-Bit) as he wrote [url=http://www.bitsfrombytes.com/fora/user/http://phpbb.bitsfrombytes.com/\/viewtopic.php?p=8072#p8072]here[/url] and RobvL on Windows XP x86 [url=http://www.bitsfrombytes.com/fora/user/http://phpbb.bitsfrombytes.com/\/viewtopic.php?p=8071#p8071]here[/url].
If you use a older (slower) computer the calculation of gcode would take longer then on a recent one.
Nordom
ED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAH
[me=Bogdan Kecman]likes the choices BFB makes a lot[/me]
I noticed that the Axon support setting has a support density % setting independent from the fill density %, just what I was asking for little time ago... I haven't tested it yet, but it does look good!
I try to use downloaded Axon and have a few questions.
1. It calculates g-code for very long time. Is there any chance to increase speed?
It uses only 1 core for calculations, it seems to me that i does not use some additional CPU instructions
(like SSE2,3 or something like that). So may be it just needs more GHz of CPU. May be it is better
to use some older CPU but with more GHz, like some P4 editions...
2. When it calculated some test STLs in g-code viewer i saw only one layer of model, is it right?
1. unfortunately - no. The slicing application is written in pytho, check if psyco is installed, it will speed up math in python a lot but I believe it is installed with axon
2. you have "buttons" to go trough layers
I got new version of Axon, it works just fine.
Previous version was beta, it calculated veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery slowly and had no buttons to see all layers of g-code.
Yes very sorry for the lack of information flowing out from BfB HQ :-[ We are flat out sorting 3000 production as it's all gone a bit mad with orders which is good but we also need to keep all existing customer happy and we are all aware this has slipped, we have taken on extra internal sales staff to help with emails and orders etc. We will also keep a closer eye on the forum in the future and have a new boy starting on the 19th of July to help with this, some of you might have heard of him before but we will be very please when eD starts for those who don't know eD he's the engineer behind the original Darwin and the Mendel. He's back from travelling the world just ready to get struck back into the world of 3D printing.
Also we would definitely be happy to see anybody who wanted to visit and would also be very happy if people were interested to have a weekend get together/workshop where we can share ideas and try stuff out.
As for Axon is should have been up but Iain has broken himself again so hopefully tomorrow :)
Thats great news Ian! It was a bit a tongue in cheek comment from my side but the news update is appreciated :) I know how hard it is when things are going wild, we had the same here the last months and did'n find time to check the forum so often anymore. Hope this will change quickly and I can reclaim the second spot postings wise ;D
The hiring of eD promises a lot of good stuff the coming months/years! Very, very exciting! Me hopes for a continuos paste pump.
The idea for a weekend/workshop sounds fun. Who would be interested? On our side, 2-3 and a baby.
I was guided to this thread by nordom and I must say thank you again! :)
Yes, this was needed - a simple front end with only basic settings, pre-filled :)
I installed the thing but there are only some "strange" profiles. All marked with 0.25 - I guess those are ment for 0.25mm heads, what about us on 0.5mm heads?
265 C for raft?!?! Isn't this a bit dangerous foe that PTFE insulator in there?
On my machine ABS starts to ooze out of the head around 210 C.
I guess those default profiles will be improved in the future?
I installed the thing but there are only some "strange" profiles. All marked with 0.25 - I guess those are ment for 0.25mm heads, what about us on 0.5mm heads?
The number 0.25 means the layer thickness (see skeinforge carve plugin, Layer Thickness or click on Advance tab and Advance Settings in Axon)
265 C for raft?!?! Isn't this a bit dangerous foe that PTFE insulator in there?
On my machine ABS starts to ooze out of the head around 210 C.
Sure it is 265°C? On my BfB Axon installation the default settings are 245°C for raft and 260°C work temperatur.
The 210°C you mentioned are definitely to low to print with ABS successfully, it does not laminate well, is brittle, extruder needs much force, etc!
Btw, 210°C is used for printing PLA, because it melts on lower temperatures - see the BfB PLA 0.25 profile in Axon
I did two print now in BfB Axon to compare the results with my Skeinforge settings and Netfabb Basic Enginge (Beta). I have to say, that my personal Skeinforge settings and the prints are far away from BfB Axons settings and print results.
Give it a try! :-)
Regards
Nordom
The number 0.25 means the layer thickness (see skeinforge carve plugin, Layer Thickness or click on Advance tab and Advance Settings in Axon)
Ah, I see. This means better print quality - in theory at least :)
Sure it is 265°C? On my BfB Axon installation the default settings are 245°C for raft and 260°C work temperatur.
Yes, I'm sure, see screenshot http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1441816/RepMan/Axon.png
I have version 1.10.1x1.
The 210°C you mentioned are definitely to low to print with ABS successfully, it does not laminate well, is brittle, extruder needs much force, etc!
While toying with Skeinforge I set the printing temp at 245 and raft temp at 240. It printed, but it wasn't a beauty :)
I tried printing the same part with these Axon produced gcode and it came out better. Raft had BIG problems sticking though.
Quote:Sure it is 265°C? On my BfB Axon installation the default settings are 245°C for raft and 260°C work temperatur.
Yes, I'm sure, see screenshot http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1441816/RepMan/Axon.png
I have version 1.10.1x1.
Oh, sorry for that, i have version 1.0.8 (i think) installed, so they changed the settings and names of the profiles, as a see on your screenshot. Maybe it's a typo, but it may also be desired: to make the raft stick very well to the print bed or something like that.
While toying with Skeinforge I set the printing temp at 245 and raft temp at 240. It printed, but it wasn't a beauty :)
I tried printing the same part with these Axon produced gcode and it came out better. Raft had BIG problems sticking though.
How big is the object you want to print? (Objects larger 50mm tend to warp more and more due to thermal stress, a heated print bed is then required)
Which Z heigth (distance between nozzle and print bed) did you set?
Did you sand your print bed?
Did you clean it before (to remove oil, grease and dust)?
Kind regards
Nordom
Not played with Axon yet but for any temperature much above 240 I would say you need the fan on for cooling. When Netfab uses higher temperatures it uses the fan. In skeinforge you would have to manually put cooling on and cool using the fan. With Skeinforge and ABS and no fan I don't use temperatures over 240 but of course this is on my machine.
Hi all,
version 1.11 is now available for download on the BfB Download section! :)
http://www.bitsfrombytes.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=80&Itemid=100009#Software
Hint:
You should uninstall the old version first, else you would get a couple of BfB Axon uninstall entries in "Add and remove Programs" section of the control panel.
Regards
Nordom
any chance that a mac or linux version will see the day of light in the not so distant future?
I've tried it a lot yesterday. I can't see where it's that better than normal skeinforge. I've printed the whistle as a test object.
It did not stick to the bed (printing without raft, disabled it because raft is not needed with PLA?)
A lot of the time it's reversing the extruder, I can't think of why, just stopping the extruder with the normal skeinforge gives already beautiful results. Then decided to copy my skeinforge profile info to a new axon profile. No change :(
I'm definately missing something,should I use a raft also for PLA objects? Can I prevent the reversing? A lot of questions I should figure out :-)
Hi,
the reversing is the "no strings" function, If you don't want it remove the M227 in the g-code.
Raft with PLA is optional, depends on the quality is the bed surface.
Raft not sticking... download the test raft from bfb website or wiki to make sure your bed is level and z is the correct height .
Raft not sticking... download the test raft from bfb website or wiki to make sure your bed is level and z is the correct height .
This works perfectly without the axon interface so it can't be a fysical adjustable thing. Will invest some more time figuring it out.
Today I noticed also print surfaces are not closed in PLA. Can't use the whistle for example because you blow air trough the sides. This must be "Grid Extra Overlap (ratio)" changed it to 0.15 already but still no use.
Didn't know where to post this ... in the Axon thread or the firmware v4.0.0 one... so I'll post here and put a link in the firmware one.
When running Axon I noticed a button at the bottom left of the settings screen that gave a choice version 1 -3.99 or version 4.0 - x.xx.... I didn't know what it was for, so after a couple of days thinking I e-mailed Iain at BfB. He did some asking around at BfB HQ and got the answer ‘um, well, er’. But then it became obvious today with the release of the new firmware :-[
So select 1-3.99 if you are using older firmware and 4.0 -x.xx for the new one ::)
But I'm now too embarrassed to ask "what does it do?"... I suppose I'll have to check the g-code.
Dave
Axon does not seem to like large (scale) stl's. I can't effectively scale the stls down. Actually never see the whole thing. Properly scaled stls open fine. Has anybody else had the same problem? Suggest a solution?
you can easily scale the .stl in Netfabb before opening in Axon.
Dave
Didn't know where to post this ... in the Axon thread or the firmware v4.0.0 one... so I'll post here and put a link in the firmware one.
When running Axon I noticed a button at the bottom left of the settings screen that gave a choice version 1 -3.99 or version 4.0 - x.xx.... I didn't know what it was for, so after a couple of days thinking I e-mailed Iain at BfB. He did some asking around at BfB HQ and got the answer ‘um, well, er’. But then it became obvious today with the release of the new firmware :-[
So select 1-3.99 if you are using older firmware and 4.0 -x.xx for the new one ::)
But I'm now too embarrassed to ask "what does it do?"... I suppose I'll have to check the g-code.
Dave
Hi Dave, the user interface is lacking in some parts like you found out with the firmware setting but also in the general workflow. Stupid small things like the progress bars resetting the whole time. But maybe thats just me having a fetish for good ui design (used to teach user interaction design in a previous life).
Anyway I am looking forward to giving this welcome addition to the family a good test drive.
I have something weird with my first test of Axion, all generated paths are duplicate on each layer. So everything is printed twice on the same layer. Did anyone else experience this? My normal install of skeinforge produces the correct gcode for the same stl file.
I could be wrong, but I thought that software had already been released.
The US distributor of the RapMan printers sent out an email on June 21st
with a link to the software and a user's manual.
These can be found on the distributor's web site:
http://www.rapmanusa.com/rapman-skeinforge.html